Hace poco platicaba con alguien acerca de cuando te conviertes en víctima. Que pasaba cuando alguien se convertía y que significaba ser víctima. Mi opinión personal es que le quitamos toda responsabilidad a alguien cuando te da lástima o sientes pena por ella, algo como: esto te pasó, pobre de ti, no es justo ni te lo mereces, lástima, porque no puedes hacer nada para cambiarlo.

Un ejemplo personal es el de una persona que conozco y que un puesto de poder, ha abusado de varias personas al borde del colapso nervioso. Una de estas personas abusadas, a pesar de que era pisoteada y humillada, justificaba a la otra diciendo que le daba mucha lástima. Decía que esta pobre persona siempre estaba sola y que no tiene amigos, por lo que sentía feo. En otras ocasiones, después de que le gritaban e insultaban, ayudaba a la persona abusiva a cargar sus cosas (que nunca son muchas ni pesadas) porque da la impresión de ser mayor de lo que realmente es y aunque sigue estando fuerte, le da pena. Como sea, siempre la justificaba y se dejaba pisotear con el pretexto de que le daba lástima, decía que no era su culpa, pero que la vida la había hecho ser así.

Yo sé que la persona abusiva ha tenido una vida difícil, pero aún así ella es responsable de sus acciones, si estas alejan a la gente, los demás no tienen porque aguantar ofensas ni malos tratos porque la otra persona “sufrió mucho”.

En clase recuerdo que nos decían que no podemos justificar a una persona diciendo que es de tal manera porque la vida la ha hecho así, pues al final, uno siempre tienen libertad de cambiar, de ser de X o Y manera. Uno puede simplemente dejarse fluir sin tener necesidad de buscar venganza o hacer drama por todo.

Ahora, es bien sabido que las víctimas pueden (y a veces suelen) convertirse en victimarios. Sabemos que muchos niños que acosan a otros en la escuela (bullying) suelen ser niños que a su vez sufren de acoso en casa y simplemente llegan a desahogarse con otros, llegan a controlar y ofender a los que no saben que no les van a contestar.

Hoy en día estamos hemos escuchado ya varias veces como es que el presidente de EUA ha mencionado en diferentes ocasiones que el resto del mundo ha abusado de su país y que él ya no lo va a permitir más ya que “América es primero”. Desde mi punto de vista, están tomando la actitud de las víctimas y el mensaje (por lo menos como yo lo he entendido) es de “pobres de nosotros, somos víctimas del terrorismo, víctimas del desprecio de los demás y de malos tratados comerciales, le damos mucho al mundo y el mundo se ha aprovechado de nosotros (por eso el famoso eslogan de “Hagamos América grande otra vez”, como si en verdad hubieran dejado de ser grandes en algún momento. Sin embargo, a mi parecer su presidente es el que se está comportando como un gran “bullly” haciendo a un lado y mostrando su poco interés por el bienestar y el respeto hacia los demás, la ética y la división entre lo personal y lo profesional, pasando por encima de todos aquellos que no están a su favor, percibiéndolos como “malos” . En redes sociales, tales como “Twitter” su gobierno ha silenciado a todas aquellas cuentas oficiales que han llegado a cometer el error de publicar cosas que no son de su agrado, así sean noticias bien sabidas en el resto del mundo y por otro lado ha lanzado ataques directos a tiendas que han dejado de vender la ropa de su hija, llegando a usar las cuentas oficiales.

 

Será posible que EUA pueda pasar de ser víctima (como él lo ha planteado) para convertirse en victimario? poniendo como pretexto como es que el mundo y las circunstancias así lo han hecho? De ser así, qué alcance y que tipo de acciones podría llegar a tomar para “remediar” la situación?

________________________

Translation

Not so long ago, I was discussing with someone what happens when you become a victim. What happens when someone becomes a victim and what does it mean. My personal opinion is that when we feel sorry or when we pity someone, we take away that persons responsibility, in our mind we switch circumstances and the dialogue becomes something like “oh I’m really sorry this happened to you, poor you, it’s not fair and you do not deserve it, shame you can’t do anything to change it, as you are a victim”.

In my case, I personally know of a very similar situation. A person in a power position has been abusing and bullying so many people for so long, some of them even had a nervous breakdown. One of the girls that was extremely bullied and abused (verbally, mentally…) kept justifying this person, she kept saying how much she pitied the “Power person” and how bad she felt because this person had no friends. It was so bad that sometimes right after she had been yelled at, she would still offer her help for things of really no importance (or things this person could do by herself). It really didn’t matter how badly this girl was being treated, she would always make up an excuse to help her, she would keep saying that is was “life’s fault” and that was why she felt so sorry for the other person.

As a matter of fact, I do know that this person did have a very difficult life, but still, she is completely responsible of the life and how she treats others. You can’t say she is this or that way, because life made her that way, you don’t have to go through life abusing others or seeking for revenge, you can always choose.

It is well known that victims can become offenders. In schools, when kids bully others usually it’s because they are being bullied at home. What happens is that they come back to school and they vent their frustrations with others, usually abusing someone that they consider as weaker, the ones that won’t defend themselves.

Nowadays, United States of America is saying that their country has been abused for a long time by the rest if the world, that they are not going to allow it anymore and are saying “America first”. From my very personal point of view, they are acting as victims, and the message (as I understand it, and as I’ve seen it) is “poor America, poor Americans, we have been victims of terrorism, victims of contempt, victims of bad business deals. We have given so much to the rest of the world, they have taken advantage of us, so lets make America great again”, as if at some point they have stopped being great.

I believe that their president is behaving as a big bad bully, taking advantage of the weak one, stepping on others without caring about wellbeing, without any signs of respect towards others. The boundary between the professional and the personal has become a very blurry one, with people around him justifying why he does things (usually, he responds because he has been a victim of something, so he is entitled to behave the way he wants to). His government has silenced all the official accounts on the internet, when they publish something he doesn’t like or agree with, even when the rest of the world sees them as facts. He has also used official internet accounts to complain about a clothing shop, which stopped selling his daughter’s brand.

I was just wondering, could it be possible that the USA (victim) becomes an offender? arguing that it was the world’s and circumstance’s fault. If so, how far could the bullying reach, how much “damage” can it cause and what can be done to stop this?

Views: 69

Replies to This Discussion

Gracias, buen ejemplo. Pienso aue mas adelante en la vida pueden ser mas sensibles con mas atencion ahora. Los profesores e padres tienen un papel clave, el abandono emocional en l infancia produce desequilibrios en el futuro...gracias.
Definitivamente no podemos hacer a un lado a todos aquellos que participan o son parte de estas situaciones. A mi parecer últimamente nos ha parecido más cómodo apuntar con el dedo a los demás y olvidar el papel que nosotros mismos jugamos en este tipo de situaciones. Creo que es importante hacer a un lado las cuestiones personales y basarnos en el respeto.
Gracias por tus comentarios.

Thank you for the translation, Jimena. I was struggling to get the precise meaning with some of the Spanish as my Spanish is far from perfect. I think the question you raise is very important. These are sweeping generalisation, but I think that there is a tendncy for many Americans to see the USA are a benefactor to the world when much of the rest of the world sees it as interfering or even bullying for its own reasons. This creates a very difficult dynamic in which one side (USA) feels they are owed something in return for all the good they have done while the other side is feeling bruised and also thinks they are owed something for having put up with such treatment by the USA. This is a difficult position to climb down from since there is grievance on both sides. It is like a domestic quarrel, but the consequences can be much bigger. Of course, there is "fault" on all sides. It is true that, in a sense, Europe has had a free ride at the expense of USA in that it does not pay for its own defense and in that it benefits from international trade across seaways that are "policed" mostly be the USA. Trump is correct to say that this is costing the USA a lot of money. However, the USA has done that in order to maintain a dominant position in the world. Before the USA did it, Britain did it. "Britain rules the waves" used to be a fact, and it cost a lot of money. The British extracted that money in part from their colonies and it looks as if one of Trump's proposals is to try to extract some from US vassals, like Japan, Korea and Europe. "If they want us to defend them, they can pay for it." However, if those three were to have to start paying a realistic amount to the USA for the "service" then I think, pretty quickly, they will say, "Don't trouble yourself. We can do it ourselves. We have the technology. Instead of paying you and supporting the American arms industry, we will support our own and pay the money to our own soldiers and sailors." When this happens, US dominance in the world will shrink or disappear. The American military is vast but, looking at recent history, it is not especially effective; certainly not cost effective. Were that to happen the world will change in many ways. I think this is inevitable eventually because of the economics. I predicted some during the election that if Trump won it would "speed up history". Things that seem inevitable will happen quicker. The US government will become bankrupt quicker. The EU either becoming a real federation or breaking apart will happen sooner. The relative positions of China, Japan and Korea will get sorted out faster. I still think this is the case.

Many of us are seriously worried about the temperament of the new POUSA. To what extent are his histrionics good acting and to what extent is he simply thin-skinned and liable to lash out inappropriately? When we are talking about the person who could, in a matter of less than an hour, unleash nuclear war upon the world, this is a deadly serious question.

Regarding the more psychological aspect of your post: one must assume that people are fully responsible for their lives and actions, yet it is certainly the case that those who have been harmed are more likely to harm others. It does not have to be so. History does not determine the future. Of three abused children, one may go on to become an abuser of others, one may treat the matter as being of little consequence and just get on with life and the third may become a philanthropist and start a charity to help abused children. When we look backwards we can often find narrative sense in what becomes of a person but this does not mean that it was inevitable that it would go that way.

Overall, I think we have to wait and see what Trump's government actually does. I'm sure that there are many conflicting voices within the White House at the moment. I am also convinced that the policies Trump has outlined in his speeches will not achieve the things he says they will. He clearly likes to be popular and is willing to promise the moon and stars, but what can he actually deliver? And what will be the response of other players? It is all very much up in the air at the moment. Many people think that realities will "tame" this government and they may be right. If they are not, then we are in for an interesting few years.

My pleasure! I'm trying my best (both with English and Spanish).
Someone mentioned in a previous post that Trump has always liked being popular, that he likes showing off. You can see this behaviour when watching his TV show “The apprentice”. He always had to step up and “show” he was the one that ruled, no matter how good the rest of the people were.
Things always change, as you said, this current situation might just speed up things, but I think that this precise moment can be really good for those ones who “go with the flow”. I can see a general change of perspectives from different countries and from different people. Now, many countries are realizing the importance of science, so they are starting to support little more that branch, some are even asking for people to go to their countries and work in science projects. There is also more conscious about the whole climate change area (thanks to the climate change denial from the USA president), many countries are speeding up the process of “going green” which will be really beneficial to the world.
The problem in the USA, from my point of view, is that their president thinks that running a country is like running a business and that life is like a reality show, where you are the star and you are entitled to say what ever you want (even if it’s a lie) without any consequences. As you well mentioned, his strategy is costing a lot to their country and I think that if things keep going the way they are going, there will be a mayor decline and not just economically.
It’s concerning to see that this person uses the media in such a way, where he can suddenly decide to accuse others of spying and then make a huge drama about it, telling the world this, without giving any evidence.
The worst part of this is that many people believe in his allegations and they have stopped asking for evidence, sadly it has become non-important. The attitude has become “he says it, then it’s true”. Think about this attitude in a criminal/legal way… I think it can become a really bad nightmare.

It also, of course, has the opposite effect. People start to think that nothing you read is true. A mild degree of scepticism is, I suggest, healthy, but if we reach a point where there are no reliable sources of information then it could be a recipe for chaos.

Agree! That degree of skepticism is actually what makes you a good researcher. I have always been thought that I should always check the facts. Many of my professors told us that it didn’t matter what they said or not said in class, we should check and if necessary correct. But there is a fine line between not believing a thing, believing in everything or being skeptic.

I always say to my students (specially in the facial expressions courses) that if they have doubts they should check, but I also tell them not to be lazy and do actual research. Google is a very powerful tool, it can destroy “facts” or sustain them. My recommendation is “go beyond the first 3 links you get when you search for something”.

I think that when we search (when we “get up” and do it) we tend to be lazy and usually we stick to the first results we get and because it’s easier, those become out facts. We can see this happening now with all this “fake news”. They are everywhere and easily spread!

When we believe everything we end up curled up in blankets, hiding in the most remote corner in the furthest darkest bedroom we have.

I think we should always encourage the rise of certain level of doubts and together, the search for facts. A real search.

When I was young my family moved often because of my father's work. Consequently I went to many different schools. Teachers at school told us things as "facts" but I soon had the attitude "Well, I'll see what they say at the next school." This has made me into a "researcher" in the sense you mention. In fact, I tend to think that if most people believe something then is is quite likely not true, and certainly worth a second look.

RSS

Events

ITZI Conference 2017

Blog Posts

Korean Version of Workshops

Posted by JAESUNG KIM on August 6, 2017 at 6:58 0 Comments

2017 여름 불교심리치료 및 상담 워크숍 3회 내용

THREE PSYCHOTHERAPY & COUNSELLING WORKSHOPS

 

WORKSHOP 1: SNOW UPON A SILVER PLATE [ 銀盌盛雪]: PRINCIPLES OF BUDDHIST PSYCHOLOGY & THEIR PSYCHOTHERAPEUTIC APPLICATION

In this workshop we shall introduce and review important aspects of Buddhist psychology including the conditioned and unconditioned mind, object relatedness, skandha process, the unity of path and goal, bodhichitta,…

Continue

Great Intentions.

Posted by Adam Dunsby on August 3, 2017 at 22:42 0 Comments

  • The power of intentions is a topic that comes up regularly for me and always provides me with food for thought. In a recent service I was struck by the gravity of the Bodhisattva vows that we sing as part of our liturgy. ”Innumerable…

Continue

Study Group.

Posted by Adam Dunsby on July 18, 2017 at 22:41 1 Comment

We just had a study group meeting at Amida Mandala Temple. Only three of us but a very rich hour. Predictably we came round to the issue of ‘is one Nembutsu enough?’ My understanding: In a sense it is, because when we call Amida we become one with his vow and the Pure Land and thus we are saved. In another sense we have to keep calling him so that he can keep saving us. As if we’re all lost in a thick fog and Amida is a few steps ahead of us illuminating the way, we have to keep him in sight…

Continue

SIMPOSIUM AT OASIS

Posted by David Brazier on July 11, 2017 at 15:30 0 Comments

On 8th July we had a meeting of six teachers at Oasis together with many visitors.

Pictures: Here

Each of the teachers gave a presentation on what they considered most significant in their practice. Then there was an extended lunch period for socialising and, finally a sessions of questions and answers.…

Continue

© 2017   Created by David Brazier.   Powered by

Badges  |  Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service